Kathavatthu - Of The Higher Life

Points of Controversy
OR
Subjects of Discourse
BEING A TRANSLATION OF THE KATHAVATTHU
FROM THE ABHIDHAMMA-PITAKA
BY
SHWE ZAN AUNG, B.A
AND
MRS. RHYS DAVIDS, M.A

3. Of The Higher Life.
Controverted Point.—That there is no higher life among
the devas.
1
From the Commentary.—' The higher life
2
is of twofold import:
path-culture and renunciation of the world. No deva practises the
latter. But the former is not forbidden them, except to those of the
unconscious plane. But some, for instance the Sammitiyas, do not
believe in any path-culture among the higher devas of the Kamaloka,
and, beyond them, of the Rupaloka, justifying themselves by the
Suttanta passage cited below.'
The Theravadin speaks :—
[1] You deny the practice of the higher life among
devas; yet you deny also [that they are physically, men-
tally, or morally defective] :—that they are, all of them,
stupid, deaf and dumb, unintelligent, communicating by
signs,
3
and incapable of discerning the meaning of what is
well or badly spoken; that they all lack faith in the
Buddha, the Doctrine, the Order; that they did not attend
the Exalted Buddha; ask him questions and delight in his
answers; that they are all of them handicapped by their
actions, by the corruptions, by the effect o f their actions;
that they are all faithless, devoid of purpose and under-
standing, incapable of reaching the right Order of the Path4
in things that are good; that they are matricides, parri-
cides, murderers of saints, shedders of holy blood, schis-
matics; that they all take life, steal, are unchaste, liars,
1
On ' deva ' see above, p. 28, n. 1.
2
Brahmacariyavasa , or best-conduct-living. The Sammi-
tiya holds by the externals ; the Theravadin is more concerned with
the essential ethical career.
3
Explained in the Comy, by muga viya hattha muddaya
vattaro, 'like dumb speakers by signs made by the hands.' On
such language cf. Dialogues, i. 21, n. 4, or Digha-Nik., i. 11, § 25.
4
Sammattang (Sansk., samyaktva , abstract noun of
samma ; ref. wrongly given in JPTS, 1910, p. 116, s.v., § II.).
Sammatta-niyamo (opposed to micchatta-niyamo , the
wrong, vicious order of things), the right law or order, insuring against
rebirth in purgatory, involving final salvation. Cf . v. 4; xii. 5.


slanderers, revilers, idle talkers, given to covetousness,
ill-will and erroneous opinion.
[2] Nay, you maintain on the other hand that they are,
and practise the opposite of all this. How then can you
say .there is no religious life among them ?
The Sammitiya speaks ;—
[8] You maintain the thesis in the affirmative, and yet
you deny that devas practise renouncing the world, the
tonsure, wearing the yellow robes, carrying the beggar's
bowl; you deny that either a Supremely Awakened one,
or those enlightened for self only,
1
or the pair of chief
disciples,
2
appear among the devas. Where then is their
' religious life ' ?
Theravadin speaks:—
[4-7] We agree that among the gods these practices
and advents are not found. But is the religious life
found only where these things are observed—the renun-
ciation, the tonsnre and the rest—and not where they are
hot observed? Only there, you say; and yet when I ask:
4
Does he who renounces the world, and so forth, lead
the religious life, and does he who does not renounce
the world, etc., not lead the religious life,' you do not
agree.
3
[8] Again, do you maintain that only where Buddhas
arise is there religious life, and that where they do not
arise, there is none? You vacillate in your reply. Now
the Exalted One was born in Lumbini, became supremely
enlightened at the foot of the Bodhi Tree, and set turning
the Norm-Wheel at Benares. Is the religious life to be
observed in those places only and not elsewhere ?
[9] I ask a similar question with regard to the Middle
Country,4 where there have been advents of those awakened

1
Pacceka-Buddhas, who did not teach the world.
2
On these, believed to attend every Buddha, see Dialogues, ii. 7.
3
Because of the attainment of the Path by laymen, and by some of
the devas.—Corny.
4
Roughly speaking, the Ganges valley, or the whole of Aryan North
India. See Rhys'Davids in JRAS, 1904, 83 f.


for self alone, and [10] with regard to the Magadhese,
1
where there was the advent of a chief pair of disciples.
[11] S.—You claim that the religious life is practised
among devas, yet you deny that it is universally practised,
for instance, among the devas of the ' unconscious sphere.'
Th.—This is only what we should both claim and deny
for mankind, for instance, that whereas the religious life is
practised among men, it is not practised among the un-
tutored barbarians of the border countries, where there is
no rebirth of such as become religieux of either sex, or of
believing laymen and lay women.
[12] S.—You say with respect to the religious life in
deva-worlds, ' There are spheres where it exists, there are
other spheres where it does not':—are both these condi-
tions represented in the unconscious sphere, and both in
the worlds of conscious devas ? If not, then where does it
exist and where does it not exist ?
Th.—The religious life exists only among such devas
as are conscious.
[13] Th.—You admit that the religious life is practised
among men.
S.—In certain places only, not in others.
Th.—Do you mean to say that both kind of places are
represented in the outlying border countries, among un-
trained barbarians, where none are born who become
religieux or pious laymen and lay women? If not, how
can you claim that the religious life is practised at all?
Where is it practised ?
8.—In the Middle Country, not in the outlying border
countries.
[14] S.—But was it not said by the Exalted One:
'In three respects, bhikkhus, do the people of India excel
both those of North Kuru and the Three-and-Thirty gods:
—in courage, in mindfulness, and in the religious life ?'
2
1
Cf. Vinaya Texts, i. 144 f.; Pss. of the Brethren, 340 f.
2
Anguttara-NiK, iv. 396.


Is the Suttanta thus? Does it not show there is no
religious life among devas ? *
Th.—Did not the Exalted One say at Savatthi: 'Here
the religious life is practised ?'1
And does this show that
it was only practised at Savatthi, and not elsewhere ?
[15] Again, the Never-Returner, for whom the five
'lower fetters' are done away with, but not, as yet, the five
'upper fetters,' deceases 'here,' is reborn 'there'2-—where
for him does the fruit [of his works] arise? 'There,' and
only there, you say. How then can you deny religious life
among the devas ?
[16] For when such an one is reborn 'there,' it is there
that he 'gets rid of the burden,' there that he compre-
hends the nature of Ill , there that he puts away the
corruptions, there that he realizes the cessation [of Ill] ,
there that he has intuition of the immutable. What then
do you mean when you say, 'There is no religious life
among the devas ?'
S.—Because it was here that he practised that Path of
which he there realizes the fruit.
[17] Th.—If you admit that the Never-Returner realizes
fruit there by the Path practised here, you must also
admit that the Stream-Winner realizes fruit here by path-
practice there. You must, similarly, admit that the Once-
Keturner and the person completing existence
3
here, realize
here the fruit won by path-practice there.
Further, since you do admit that the Stream-Winner
realizes fruit here won by path-practice here, you must
admit that the Never-Returner may, similarly, realize fruit
1
We cannot trace this quotation.
2
I.e., in the heavens called 'Pure Abodes.'—Corny. There, and
and not on earth, he was believed to complete existence (parinib-
bayati) . In the Suttanta phrase, he became a ' there-utter-going-
outer' (tattha- parinibbayi) , e.g., Majjh. Nik., ii. 146; Angut-
tara-Nik., i. 232, etc. The Pure Abodes were the summit of the
Bupa-beaven,, the limit of material, if ethereal, rebirth. See Com-
pendium, p. 188 f.
3
Parinibbayi puggalo . The latter word is now used in its
common or popular meaning—the only meaning accepted in Theravada.


there won by path-practice there. Again, just as you admit
that the Once-Returner and the person completing exist-
ence may, by path-practice here, realize fruit here, so must
you similarly admit that the Never-Returner may realize
fruit there won by path-practice there.
[18] If you declare that a person who, ' leaving this
life, attains consummation [in the Pure Abodes],'
1
practises
the path without putting away the corruptions, you must
admit it no less in the case of a person who has worked
for the realization of the fruit of Stream-Winning, or the
fruit of the One-Return, or the fruit of Arahantsbip.
Again, i f you declare that a person who has worked for
the realization of the fruit of Stream-Winning, or for the
fruit of the One-Return, or for that of Arahantship, practises
the path and puts away the corruptions simultaneously,
you must also admit as much in his case who, leaving
this life, attains consummation [in the Pure Abodes].
[19] You are admitting [by the position taken up with
regard to the thesis], that a Never-Returning person, when
he is reborn there, has ' done that which was to be done,'
2
is in the condition of having practised. But this is
tantamount to declaring that the Arahant is reborn,—that
the Arahant goes from one life to another, goes from one
destination to another, goes from one cycle to another of
renewed life, goes from one rebirth to another—which of
course you deny.
You cannot, again, admit those qualifications in the
Never-Returner and deny him those of ' one who has got
rid of the burden,'
2
when he is reborn there; for then you
must admit that he will [there] practise the path again3 to
get rid of the burden.
[20] Similarly, whatever other attainments in the re-

1 Idha-vihaya-nittho puggalo = 'a Never-Returner•• who
consummates after leaving this life.'—Corny.
2
A phrase always associated with Arahantship. See above, 2, § 47.
3
This would bring ' the religious life' into the life of the devas, the
Never-Returner being then reborn, finally, as a deva of the Pure
Abodes.


ligious life you withhold from the Never-Returner on his
•final rebirth there:—understanding of Ill , putting away
of corruptions, realization of the cessation of Ill , intuition
of the immutable—you compel him, in order to win them,
to 4
practise the path' [among the devas as deva]. Else
you declare implicitly that he there completes existence
without winning one or the other of them.
[21] S.—Just as a deer wounded by an arrow, though
he may run far, yet dies of his hurt, even so does the
Never-Returner, by the path here practised, realize there
the fruit thereof.
Th—The deer wounded by an arrow, though he run far,
yet dies of his hurt with the arrow in him. But does the
Never-Returner, when by the path here practised he there
realizes the fruit thereof, bear the arrow with him?
1
S.—Nay, that cannot truly be said.