Points of  Controversy 
OR 
Subjects of  Discourse 
BEING A TRANSLATION OF THE KATHAVATTHU 
FROM THE ABHIDHAMMA-PITAKA 
BY 
SHWE ZAN AUNG, B.A 
AND 
MRS. RHYS DAVIDS, M.A
BOOK XXIII 
1. Of  United  Resolve. 
Controverted  Point.—That  sexual relations may be entered 
upon with a united resolve.1 
From the Commentary.—Snch  a vow may be undertaken, some 
think—for  instance, the Andhakas and the Vetulyakas2—by a human 
pair who feel  mutual sympathy or compassion3 [not passion merely], 
and who are worshipping, it may be, at some Buddha-shrine, and 
aspire to be united throughout their future  lives. 
[1] Th.—Do  you imply that a united resolve may be 
undertaken which does not befit  a recluse, does not become 
a bhikkhu, or that it may be undertaken by one who has 
cut off  the root [of  rebirth], or when it is a resolve that 
would lead to a Parajika offence ?4 
Or when it is a resolve by which life  may be slain, theft 
committed, lies, slander, harsh words, idle talk uttered, 
burglary committed, dacoity, robbery, highway robbery, 
adultery, sack and loot of  village or town be committed . .5 
[You must be more discriminating in your use of  the 
term ' with a united resolve'!] 
1
 Ekadhippayo. There is nothing objectionable in the relation 
so entered upon, except, of course, for the recluse or a member of 
the Order. 
2
 See XVII. 6. 
3
 Karunna, 'pity,' not the term anukampana , which does 
much duty in Buddhism to express affection  in social and conjugal 
relations. See Ency. Religions,  'Love, Buddhist.' On the belief  in 
such repeated unions, see Maha Kassapa's legend, Pss. of  the Brethren, 
p. 359 f., and Bhadda's (his wife's)  verses, Pss, of  the Sisters,  p. 49. 
4
 Meriting expulsion from  the Order. 
5
 Dialogues,  i. 69.  
2. Of  Bogus Arahants. 
Controverted  Point.—That  infra-human  beings, taking the 
shape of  Arahants,1 follow  sexual desires. 
From  the Commentary.—This  belief  arose in consequence of  the 
dress and deportment of  evil-minded bhikkhus, and is held by some— 
for  instance, certain of  the Uttai apathakas. 
[1]  Th.—Would  you also say that such beings, resem-
bling Arahants, commit any or all such crimes as are stated 
above (XXIII. 1) ? You deny; but why limit them to 
one only of  those crimes ? 
3. Of  Self-govern  ed  Destiny. 
Controverted  Point.—That  a Bodhisat (or future  Buddha) 
(a), goes to an evil doom, (b) enters a womb, (c) performs 
hard tasks, (d)  works penance under alien teachers of  his 
own accord and free  will. 
From the Commentary.—Some—for  instance, the Andhakas—-judge 
that the Bodhisatta, in the case of  the Six-toothed Elephant Jataka2 
and others, was freely  so reborn as an animal or in purgatory, that 
he freely  performed  difficult  tasks, and worked penance under alien 
teachers. 
[1]  (a)  Th.—Do  you mean that he so went and endured 
purgatory, the Sanjiva, Kalasutta, Tapana, Patapana, San-
ghataka, Roruva, and Avichi hells? If  you deny, how can 
you maintain your proposition ? Can you quote me a 
Sutta to support this ? 
[2] (b).—You maintain that he entered the womb of  his 
own free  will.3 Do you also imply that he chose to be 
reborn in purgatory, or as an animal? That he possessed 
1
 It should be remembered that in a wider, popular sense, any 
religieux were—at least, in the commentarial narratives — called 
Arahants—i.e., 'worthy ones,' 'holy men.' Cf. Pss. of the Sisters, 
p. 130; Dhammapada Commentary,  i. 400. 
2
 No. 514.
 3
 The PTS edition omits Amanta here. 
magic potency ? You deny.1 I ask it again. You assent.2 
Then did he practise the Four Steps to that potency—will, 
effort,  thought, investigation ? Neither can you quote me 
here a Sutta in justification. 
[3] (c).—You  maintain further  that the Bodhisat of  his 
own free  will performed  that which was painful  and hard 
to do. Do you thereby mean that he fell  back on wrong 
views such as ' the world is eternal,' etc., or ' the world is 
finite,'  etc., or 'infinite,' etc., 'soul and body are the same,' 
. . . 'are different,' 'the Tathagata exists after  death,' 'does 
not exist,' ' both so exists and does not,' ' neither so exists 
nor does not ' ? Can you quote me a Sutta in justification? 
[4] (d).—You maintain further  that the Bodhisat o f  his 
own free  will made a series of  penances following  alien 
teachers. Does this imply that he then held their views ? 
Can you quote me a Sutta in justification  ? . . . 
4. Of  Counterfeit  States  of  Consciousness. 
Controverted  Point.—That  there is that which is not 
(a)  lust, (b)  hate, (c)  dulness, (d)  the corruptions, but which 
counterfeits  each of  them. 
From the Commentary.—Such  are with regard to (a)  amity, pity, 
approbation ; with regard to (b)  envy, selfishness,  worry; with regard 
to (c) the sense of  the ludicrous ; with regard to (d) the suppressing of 
the discontented, the helping of  kindly bhikkhus, the blaming of  the 
bad, the praising of  the good, the declaration of  the venerable Pilinda-
Vaccha about outcasts,3 the declarations of  the Exalted Ones about the 
incompetent or irredeemable.4 Such is the opinion held, for  instance, 
by the Andhakas. 
1
 Free will, as liberty to do what one pleases through a specific 
power or gift,  is practically a denial of  karma. Hence this question.— 
Comy. 
2
 He denies with reference  to iddhi as accomplished by practice, 
then assents with reference  to iddhi as accomplished by merit.--
Comy. 
3
 Vasala. Udana, iii. 6. 
4
 Mogha-purisa — e.g., Sunakkhatta, the Licchavi (Digha-
Nik.,  iii. 27 f.).  The term is preceded by khelasika-vadang , 
'declaration about spittle-eaters,' presumably a term of  opprobrium, 
but the context of  which we cannot trace
[1] Th.—Do  you imply that there is that which is not 
contact, not feeling,  not perceiving, not volition, not cogni-
tion, not faith,  not energy, not mindfulness,  not concen-
tration, not understanding, but which simulates each of 
these ? 
[2] Similarly  for  (b),  (c), (d). 
5. Of  the Undetermined 
Controverted  Point.—That  the aggregates, elements, con-
trolling powers—all save 111 , is undetermined.1 
From the Commentary.—Such  is the opinion held by some—for 
instance, certain of  the Uttarapathakas and the Hetuvadins. Their 
authority they find  in the lines : 
'Tis  simply Ill  that  riseth, simply Ill 
That  doth  persist,  and  then fadeth  away. 
Nought  beside  Ill  it is that  doth  become ; 
Nought  else but Ill  it is doth  pass away.2 
[1] Th.—Do  you then maintain that [the marks of  the 
conditioned are lacking in, say, the material aggregate— 
that] matter is not impermanent, not conditioned, has not 
arisen because of  something, is not liable to decay, to perish, 
to be devoid of  passion, to cessation, to change? Is not 
the opposite true ? 
[2] Do you imply that only Ill is caused ? Yes ? But 
did not the Exalted One say that whatever was impermanent 
was Ill ? Hence, if  this be so, and since matter is imper-
manent, you cannot maintain that only Ill is determined. 
[3] The same argument holds good for  the other four 
aggregates (mental), for  all the mechanism of  sense,3 for  all 
controlling powers.4 
END OF THE TRANSLATED TEXT 
1
 Aparinipphanna . See p. 261, n. 6. 
2
 Verses of  Vajira, Bhikkhuni. Samyutta-Nik.,  i. 135 ; Pss.  of  the 
Sisters, p. 191. Cf. above, p. 61. 
3
 This includes the categories 22-51, enumerated on p. 15 f . 
4
 This includes those enumerated (52-73) on p. 16.
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